Two Way Hard Three | Las Vegas Casino & Design Blog

May 31, 2007

Atlantic City Photo Update

Posted by Hunter

We really don't do a lot of Atlantic City coverage - I've only been there one time myself... Not a place that I would want to visit on a regular basis but I had an interesting day there and a great meal at one of Borgata's gourmet rooms.

Borgata itself was impressive - standing in their casino you would be hard pressed to forget you were on the Jersey shore. It feels like a Mandalay Bay-ish type of place.

Anyway, thanks to reader Tom M., for a slew of photo updates:

Some interesting new projects like an expansion at Borgata, plus of course MGM Mirage's possible entry into the market - AC is hopping!

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Read archived comments (37 so far)
June 1, 2007 5:34 AM Posted by Katsia

I remember Atlantic city: luxirious downtown and pretty dangerous for your life just one block from the center. I invite you to visit our new casino and poker forum. I'm sure it will be interested for you to discuss gambling news. Thank you!!!

June 1, 2007 6:32 AM Posted by Brian Fey

Its public knowledge that Trump has his three places up for sale. I've heard rumors Wynn might be a buyer. I know this is just a rumor, but I know he is interested in the Altantic City market. I also know, land is hard to find, and Trump has some great property, and room for expansion. If the price were right, I am sure Wynn would at least give it a look.

June 1, 2007 10:34 AM Posted by detroit1051

I'm not entirely sold on Atlantic City. This article from last weekend is worth reading, imo:

June 1, 2007 11:55 AM Posted by Dave

Thanks for the AC update--I'm going back there next week and will try to get some photos inside the Sands to preserve the failed casino for posterity. And if you want to see some pictures of the famous Boardwalk Cats and other local landmarks, you can check my AC page here:
As far as what should happen in AC, Wynn should buy the former Bader Field site and develop Wynn East there. With Borgata, teh Pinncale casino, the new Harrah's, the planned Hilton expansion, and the other projects in the pipeline, this would give the city something to appeal to people beyond the slots.

Being a third-generation native, it's frustrating to see the lack of vision there. On the positive side, developments like the Walk (outlet stores) and the Pier at Caesars (actually the old Ocean One with a dramatic facelift) are encouraging.

I could write a book (and someday I probably will) about what's worked and what hasn't on Atlantic City, but I think that people should approach it with an open mind. It's not Vegas, but it's got a lot of upside.

June 1, 2007 12:53 PM Posted by detroit1051

Dave, Dan Lee made clear in the article I linked that Bader Field development could change his plans:
"But if New Jersey were to allow slots at the Meadowlands Racetrack, Lee said, that could be "a deal-stopper." So could a decision by the state to allow a rival casino company to build a gambling resort on Bader Field, a historic airport that recently shut down."

Hope you give us a report after your trip.

June 1, 2007 1:29 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Dave: Having lived in Atlantic City yourself for a large portion of your life, you know damn well that Steve Wynn (unofficially) is NOT welcome there by the New Jersey Casino Control Commission ever since the licensing issues that arose + the "questionable" suitability requirements that he faced when he first opened the Golden Nugget A.C. way back in 1980, having been granted only a "temporary license" subject to review on an interval reporting basis. When Wynn 'finally' received a permanent unlimited gaming license in New Jersey, he promptly sold the Golden Nugget to Hilton for something like $110M (realizing a considerable profit that he then rolled into the construction of the Mirage, along with Milken's ability to raise the "illegal" junk bond funds which represented the majority of the financing required to build the Mirage) DON'T expect Steve to be entering into a joint-venture deal, or ANYTHING over there in A.C. anytime soon. Wynn had better concentrate his limited assets (since WYNN is highly overleveraged at this point) on Macau right now instead of attempting to make a "come back" in Atlantic City, even AFTER 27 years, the NJCCC, to this day, is no "friend" of Steve Wynn.

June 1, 2007 1:44 PM Posted by Tom M

Hi everyone, just a few comments about my trip:

I live about 90 min from AC and up to now had only made day trips. I was pleasantly surprised by the quality of my room. The Trump Plaza is about as ugly as architecture gets on the outside. However, I found the room I had to be very nicely appointed, if a bit small. I had a partial ocean view which was nice. The location of the Plaza on the boardwalk is central, making it an ideal base for exploration. Also, mid-week rate special was only $65/nt making it a bargain. By comparison the same two nights at the Borgata ran for $150/nt. Also, the Trump Plaza has a weird stainless steel swimming pool. I have never seen that before. Go figure.

I spent most of the first day taking these pictures and walking around looking for construction. The new tower(called the Water Club) at Borgata is topped off and well on its way. I asked a few employees when it was supposed to open and heard anywhere from late 2007 to spring 2008. Their website is saying spring 2008. Also, next door at Harrah's they just opened a spectacular new indoor pool. That is in the dome you see in the Harrah construction pics. I took a couple of pictures but could not enter the place. I plan on staying at Harrah's sometime in the fall just to try out the new pool. I think it looks really good. In addition Harrah's has a whole new shopping venue that leads out to the new pool from the casino and a new tower under construction due to open late 2008, early 2009. They also have moved their buffet right next to the pool.

By the way there is a huge piece of empty land between Harrah's and the Borgata that could easily fit one or even two mega resorts. I am not sure who owns the property but it is a potential gold mine.

There are lots of exciting things going on in AC. A few of the most recently completed projects are the Borgata expansion, with restaurants by Bobby Flay and Michael Mina as well as a really big new poker room. The Caesar's Pier shopping project is now also almost finished. All of the stores and restaurants are open and there is just some exterior work still being completed. There is a large amount of space open for billboards and such, I was hoping for something of a time square electronic style show but that has not yet come to fruition. Another newer part is called the Quarter at the Tropicana. This opened last summer and has held up well. It is an indoor mall with a Havana decor and painted sky etc. It is much smaller than the Venetian or Forum shops but it is very nice with lots of great restaurants and shops and an IMAX theater. Another great addition(form last year) is the House of Blues at the Showboat. There is a seperate HOB Casino along with the concert venue and restaraunt. They also have a very nice, if smaller poker room(where I spent most of my second day playing tournaments, sorry no wins)and some HOB themed rooms. There is also a new Outlet shopping district between Ceasars and the convention center. This is an outdoor mall several blocks long filled with outlet shops and a few restaraunts. This area in general makes the general neighborhood of the mid boardwalk area(Caesar's and Trump) much nicer and safer.

Finally, the Donald just "opened" something called the "Spice Road" at the Taj. I liken this to putting lipstick on a pig and calling it new. It was just a decorative renovation of part of the second floor with some new shops and eateries, but didn't do much for me. Trump has really let his properties go down the toilet, especially the public spaces, and they need major facelifts, not minor spruce ups.

While AC will never equal what is going on in Las Vegas, I feel it has made major strides since the first time I went there during the Borgata construction. At that time it was really depressing and Trump dominated most of the place. Now it is vibrant and everyone is fixing up their properties. There are tons of great new restaraunts and shopping. I think the suceess of the Borgata woke up this sleepy little gaming town and the operators have started to sieze the moment. I only hope that there is enough vision and guts to keep the renaissance going.

June 1, 2007 1:51 PM Posted by Pikes

Just think how Steve Wynn could transform AC with a better mousetrap.

June 1, 2007 2:54 PM Posted by mike_ch

Wynn is a one-trick pony: Luxury, luxury, luxury. It's an impressive trick, to be sure, but each of his properties is fancier and more exclusive and more plush and more expensive than the last.

Atlantic City doesn't really need a Wynn as much as it needs a Palms. Right now, to steal a phrase, there is no "there" there.

June 1, 2007 3:28 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Pikes: Steve, for reasons that [I] am not able to disclose publicly, will most likely NOT be involved in the contribution of Atlantic City's continued "revival". Borgata has been able to establish itself as a benchmark that all futute operators will need to meet or exceed in A.C. BTW - Trump "personally" is essentially "finished" in the Atlantic City gaming market, despite the fact that he has alreday transferred the majority of his investment in those properties, which he previously controlled, + continues to claim that these particular Atlantic City gaming investments represent only a mere "2%" of his total net worth, which is complete B.S.!!! (Donald, I have the numbers) Trump has no clue whatsoever how to run a profitable gaming operation in Atlantic City, despite that fact that his properties were early entrants in the market, [their] Bankruptcy petition endorses this fact. Once again, Steve Wynn would be a total "idiot" (which he apparently has already proven himself to be on numerous occasions) to even consider or attempt to re-enter the Atlantic City market at this point in time with Las Vegas + Macau being the major focus of attention of the leading operators. For a substandard public company such as WYNN to take on additional risk + debt would be foolish. Take a look at the direction where MGM is currently headed towards, with their plans on developing worldwide 'non-gaming' brands...I can't believe that MGM/Mirage are investing $160M in Tony Marnell III's (Tony Marnell's son) in the 'M RESORT' 11 miles south of Mandalay Bay (I guess it might have something to do with fact that HIS father's company, Marnell/Corrao is both DESIGNING + CONSTRUCTING the project for his own 33 year old son at either a significant discount, or for FREE! Do you think?

June 1, 2007 3:54 PM Posted by Pikes

Leonard, I was actually being sarcastic with that comment, (Long week, needed happy hour) Had to run, But I did hear a rumor that Roger Thomas was seen running around AC with an armload of drapes looking for a place to hang them.

June 1, 2007 3:55 PM Posted by Hunter

Man, I spat my water on my screen. That was funny.

June 1, 2007 4:17 PM Posted by Dave

Tom,that piece of land between Harrah's and Borgata is where MGM Mirage would put "City Center East" if they chose to. I think MGM also owns the land between Trump Marina and the shore, but I could be wrong. Here's a map from Google:,+NJ+08401,+USA&ie=UTF8&ll=39.378862,-74.430077&spn=0.012025,0.020084&t=h&z=16&om=1
It's pretty old, pre-Water Club construction, but you should get the picture. If Trump sold the Marina to someone who redeveloped it into something nice, this could be a pretty hot casino corner.

Leonard, I don't have an inside line on the "M" story (though there's a good article here: but it seems like a swap of the MGM Mirage Laughlin properties for a big piece of M with an option to get more. Not a bad strategy if they want to keep on racking up real estate in the Strip area.

As far as Wynn in AC, he was incredibly successful with the Golden Nugget, which at the time people said was too luxurious for the market. This was back in 1980, when most operators were trying to open as quickly as possible with max gaming positions. The thinking was, let's hit the jackpot here before Florida legalizes casinos and tanks the market. It's about the same idea that was common in Vegas until 1955.

That's an astute comment about the Palms, Mike. A few years ago I was talking with a NJ gaming official and said exactly that. The reply: "But they've only got 500 rooms! What would the guys who are spending $2 billion say if something like that came in here?" He absolutely missed the point, which I think says a lot about the attitude out there.

I might do a very short trip report, but seeing as I don't stay in a hotel room I don't usually have too much to report. I'll definitely stop by the Taj and see some old friends and get a first-hand look at Spice Road and the 800-room tower that's going up across from the bus waiting area. Funny, that's a phrase I haven't heard in Vegas for a while. It's a different market, all right.

June 1, 2007 4:34 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Hey Pikes: No offense, but regardless of your 'sarcastic' intentions in your post, here is the true s*it, I have been informed that both Roger Thomas' days are "numbered" as well as Butler's tenure as head of WD+D. Roger Thomas only needs to rely on his family trust fund + do us all a FAVOR by giving up on his interior design career (Roger, I've actually been in one of your multi-million dollar interior designed manse here in L.V., YUCK!) However, Roger, if you still feel the need to "work" I hear that Heidi Fleiss is looking for an "accomplished" interior designer for her soon to be launched STUD FARM! LOL

June 1, 2007 4:42 PM Posted by Hunter

Okay, we're way off topic.

Thomas and Butler don't have anything to do with Atlantic City (as of today) - keep it on topic please - though I did meet and interview Butler and was a super-nice and cool guy.

Atlantic City...

June 1, 2007 5:04 PM Posted by John

Leonard, how can you say Wynn isn't welcome in the Atlantic City after the Golden Nugget when the state sold him Borgata's plot for what amounted to about a miniscule amount. Wynn was truly intending on developing the property and bringing back Atlantic City, and he had the full support of the NJ state government. The only thing that got in his way, so to speak, was, you know, having to sell Mirage Resorts. However, the point still stands that he was, and probably still is, welcome in Atlantic City.

June 1, 2007 5:27 PM Posted by hail2skins

Seems like I used to go out to Vegas more for the better gambling conditions there than in AC. However, with the relative deterioration of gaming conditions as well as higher minimums on the Strip, seeing the new places in Vegas has become much more of the attraction to me. I'm going out in 3 weeks and won't see much new open (Red Rock Station had just opened when I was out last and I was able to check it out), but it'll be nice to see all the places under construction in person instead of just in the great photos that this site and others provide.

I think I've heard the phrase "AC is going to the next Vegas" as much as I've heard "Vegas is now overbuilt." Tom is right that the existing places have spruced themselves up to some extent but there just haven't been a whole lot of new places. There was a 6 year lag between the Taj and the Wild Wild West (which didn't even have a hotel) and then another 7 until the Borgata. And I guess the place that opens on the Sands site will be next, but that's not projected until like 2011. The sprucing up is nice, but its just not enough. The casinos themselves in large part are the same tired old joints, with of course the exception of Borgata.

Detriot, that was an interesting article you posted. As pointed out in the text, I am concerned about the effect of the private equity taking over will have on the building of new places. You haven't heard anything about Harrah's masterplan for redeveloping its center Strip portfolio. What happens if Cpt. Kirk takes MGM private?

June 1, 2007 5:28 PM Posted by Hunter

I'm with John on this one.

Corzine was just talking up Steve Wynn - sounded pretty welcome to me.

Yes, the NJ CCC is tougher than Nevada... But...

It seems to me that the anti-Wynn stuff is ancient history and unless someone here has some evidence to the contrary or can prepare an argument that goes deeper than Deep Throat stuff, I'm not convinced.

June 1, 2007 6:09 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Dave: (Hunter, I'm staying ON topic here - OK), while it's true that Steve was one of the original operators, after my father's design + construction of the Playboy Hotel/Casino (the second actual REAL projcet in A.C. after Resorts Int'l.), although Hef encountered licensing issues, which is well documented by the subsequent number of owner/operators of that property resulting in Trump buying the project + eventually 'dismanlting' the tower because he did not have a gaming license for the newly named "Trump World's Fair" + the fact that the original Playboy Hotel/Casino, despite that it was the FIRST tri-level casino EVER built in history on a very constricted site, directly adjacent to the Convention Center, it failed for THREE reasons: 1) Hef could not qualify for a permanent gaming license, 2) The concept of a tri-level casino simply would NEVER work based of the limited site (floor plate) restrictions, 3) It subsequently went through multiple owner/operators that NEVER were able to turn a profit. Had Hef originally been granted a gaming license from 'day-one', it would have been one of the most successful properties in the "early" days of Atlantic City Casino/Hotel development. The fact that [Playboy] were able to secure + include the southerly "podium" property across the street, reduced the tower height by almost one-third, but provided the necessary + additional public space making the project viable (I was one of the participatory designers on the original Playboy Hotel Atlantic City before I left my father's firm) Wynn was DENIED a permanent gaming license for a long period of time. Dave, I know that this is your expertise, however, at the time, the Florida referendum had little chance of passing at the time. Actually, the Golden Nugget, Atlantic City revenue was actually in the RED when Wynn sold it to Hilton for $110M. Steve, due to regulatory conflicts was CHASED out of New Jersey, by his own admisssion! My company actually built the architectural scale model for Joel Bergman/Golden Nugget, Inc. of the Golden Nugget, Atlantic City in the late 1970's.

June 1, 2007 6:21 PM Posted by John

Actually, here's a link to my above post, in regards to Wynn's welcome in Atlantic City (circa 1998) and Trump's response to it. Honestly, it's a really interesting read.

(Keep in mind, it's quite long, but worth the time to read)

June 1, 2007 7:14 PM Posted by mike_ch

I'm sorry if this isn't completely on the nose of the topic, but it's something I wanted to ask for aw while: Leonard, what's your feelings on Trump? It sounds like you don't like him but you don't hate him as much as another prominent and egotistical figure whose name often graces this site.

I don't like Donald Trump, but that's just because I feel that he's an arrogant chump, the kind of guy who will sign his book while telling you what the current dollar value of his signature is. Does the whole issue over the Xanadu property still loom over your impressions of him, or is your family "over it" now?

June 1, 2007 7:14 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

John: I've actually read ALL of this stuff before. I only wish I could provide you with the "true + actual proof" that Steve Wynn is NOT on the "most desirable" list of "preferred" operators with the New Jersey Casino Control Commission. Hunter, you are totally wrong on this, it's not "ancient history" by a long shot! However, you guys are just going to have to wait until I am able to provide everybody with undeniable, totally substantiated actual proof when I eventually am able to publish the real facts on my future website "". I am SO tempted to respond to, what are totally inaccurate + misinformed comments made here, but my attorneys absolutely INSIST that I refrain from posting certain details in connection with Steve personally, or other knowledge of potential (alleged) illegal practices in connection with the operation of Wynn Resorts, Ltd. as an ongoing concern, including, but not limited to, any of [their] subsidiary companies until I am personally + legally protected against any potential liability. Trust me, this will be better than!

June 1, 2007 7:46 PM Posted by Hunter

Well, if you have some juicy info that 'proves me wrong', I have no problem admitting that and citing it here.

Still, I'm looking at this from the surface with a dose of practicality... New Jersey likes money. Steve Wynn likes money. Atlantic City + Steve Wynn = more money.

Steve Wynn is like the Walt Disney of gambling. The lore may eclipse the reality but there's no escaping how the public/spin relates to the man/company. I can't imagine a scenario where he wasn't licensed.

I have a question for ya - if the rap on Wynn is bad enough to stop him in his tracks in Jersey, what was going to happen with Borgata??

Mirage Resorts was the 50% co-developer with Boyd - in your view, were they going to be denied licensing? I mean, he was making waves with all the tunnel movement, right? If everyone knew he wasn't going to be licensed, how did he have any power to 'strong-arm' the legislature/city into getting that tunnel dialed in? I'm seriously asking. How would this have worked given the scenario you pose?

Dave - you know a lot more about AC than me - your thoughts?

June 1, 2007 7:49 PM Posted by Pikes

Is the Playboy property mentioned earlier now Trump Plaza, Marina, Taj?

June 1, 2007 7:57 PM Posted by Hunter

Not to drag this off-topic but a quick question on this 'anti-Wynn' stuff that's gonna be on your Web site...

Given that I have a good bit of experience developing Web sites, if you're shooting for a Fall launch I have to assume that you have an 'alpha' or 'beta' site already going, or at the very least, some designs for the site itself - can you share any of this preliminary stuff with us?

June 1, 2007 8:24 PM Posted by John

Hunter, it's intersting that you make the Walt Disney comparison. I once wrote a research paper, for a high school English class, comparing these two men. When I stayed at Wynn in Dec. '05, I had it couriered to Steve, but I don't think he ever got it. Eh...

Back to that comparison, it's really true, even from Leonard's perspective. Walt was very comparable in terms of his management style and love of overspending. The only true difference has to be that Walt really liked to take care of his employees, even though his company treats them pretty poorly today. (Sorry that was so off topic, but I thought I'd just post it)

June 1, 2007 8:25 PM Posted by Brian Fey

I leave you guys alone for just a few hours, and see what happens? :)

As to some of these last several posts...I'm gonna have to call B.S.

June 1, 2007 10:15 PM Posted by Tom M


Thanks for the info on the land next to Borgata. I did see some cranes next to Taj but didn't see much above ground. They were located on an opposite side and I didn't walk around to see what was up. I doubt that they are very far into construction. My bad, I should have gotten pictures. PS I am reading your new book right now, and its very good so far.

June 1, 2007 10:36 PM Posted by mike_ch

Pikes: I'm pretty sure the World's Fair (formerly Playboy) is just an empty lot now. They announced a $750mil casino for it around 98, but Trump hasn't opened a casino in AC since the Taj.

Comparing Disney to casinos, oh boy this is right up my alley, heh. I actually wrote up a two paragraph thing here but I don't want to take Hunter's passive comment and turn it into a loose off-topic conversation on it's own. Heh.

As for John's comment, Disney still takes decent care of their employees, their benefits and programs are great. Keeping that job, however, can be difficult depending on the field (animation was cut enormously in the past ten years.) Uncle Walt had issues with unions (see: 1941 animators walkout) that was far more publicly embarrassing than Steve's.

June 2, 2007 12:15 AM Posted by JW

This is going to be very off-topic, but my apologies in advance, since I can't keep it in any longer.

I've appreciated and enjoyed this site and its posts and user comments for awhile, but Leonard, your posts are getting completely ridiculous. You turn every civil discussion into an anti-Wynn rant, when the original topic frequently has nothing to do with Wynn. Your posts are emotional and lack factual evidence. You cite secret and mysterious "facts" and "sources" that you cannot reveal. You use terrible grammar and weird punctuation, much like teenagers enjoy doing (hopefully your "lawyers" don't have this problem). In the end, you don't convince anyone. Any adult with an average IQ only finds you immature and irritating.

Open up your website and/or start providing some hard evidence. Until one or both things happen, no one will take you seriously.

By the way, ""? You couldn't come up with a more professional name? When is the last time you heard a mature adult use the phrase "you suck"? For your own good, I hope your hotshot lawyers are a generation more mature and intelligent than you are.

June 2, 2007 6:29 AM Posted by Brian Fey

I guess at the end of the day, it comes down to one simple thing. 99% of the people out there, really just don't care. I mean if Steve Wynn is the worst person on the face of this earth, most people really don't care. I feel like he designs, builds, and operates the best hotels in Las Vegas over and over again. He has proven, time and time again, that he can build a better mouse trap. He has staffed it with amazing people. He did hit a small bump over this dealer thing, but its not that big of a deal, its been going on for 9 months now, and business has kept rising. The more people I talk to that stay there, tell me how great the service is. The more people I tell to stay there, do. And many of those people tell me, that never again, will they stay anywhere else in L.V. So Steve Wynn could be a serial killer, and people will still stay in his great hotels. People don't chose to stay at Wynn because he is a nice guy, or a horrible guy. Last time I checked, staying at Wynn does not entitle you to one free evening with Steve Wynn. So people don't really care how great or not great he is. I think we have to look at history here. We have to look at the numbers, and the numbers don't lie. Steve Wynn built the highest revenue grossing hotel in LV twice already, starting with Mirage, and Bellagio, soon Wynn will out gross Bellagio, I guarantee it, just give it another few years. So others on this board might hate Wynn, but I guess the majority of people going to LV must not. This thing might actually help Wynn. I mean, just look at, since that site launched their growth and expansion has been huge! :)

June 2, 2007 10:29 AM Posted by Leonard Stern

Hey JW: For your information, EVERYTHING I report here is based on 100% FACT + I am fully prepared to support + back up any remarks that I post! I have indeed done so here on numerous occasions in the past. What are you, a f*cking English teacher or something? Sorry, I didn't know that I was being graded on grammar, syntax + spelling! For Christ's sake, we have been down this SAME road before, + until your malicious post today taking direct aim at attempting to discredit me, my comments have proven to be both informative + accurate as well as CIVIL towards fellow contributors on this forum. I thought we were way beyond that stage, but it only takes one cretin like yourself to light the fire all over again! Since [you] cannot contribute or offer something constructive towards the discussion, it appears that your ONLY option is to attack MY level of intelligence + maturity by maligning me. You don't even KNOW me, so why don't you keep your malicious comments + name-calling to yourself. Now I ask you, WHO is the immature one? If you dont't agree with my ant-Wynn "rants" then DON'T READ MY POSTS! However, if you care to educate yourself + learn something about the man + the controversial manner in which he conducts business, I suggest that you might at least consider what I have to offer, whether or not you agree with my viewpoint or not. If my comments come across as "emotional", that very well may be true, however, I assure you that I speak for many hundreds of thousands out there who are afraid to express their own opinions ot of fear of reprisal by the "Most Powerful Man in Nevada". For Christ's sake man, this is a BLOG, get-a-clue! JW, personally I couldn't give a rat's ass what the f*ck YOU think. You have no knowledge of who my so-called "hotshot" legal counsel are. Hey Professor JW, how did I do, do I at least get a "C" for effort? LOL I certainly don't need to be berated by a moron like yourself. (Note to Hunter: If you expect me to just sit back + take this sort of mudslinging from "JW" you can just forget about it. Therefore, I DON'T expect you to censor my response since YOU elected to post JW's defamatory comment in the first place). Hey JW, sorry, "Einstein", do us all a big favor and crawl back under the rock from whence you came! Yours truly, "King Leonard".

June 2, 2007 4:23 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Brian: I want you to know that I respect your devout affirmation towards Steve + Wynn Resorts, Ltd. You are most certainly entitled to your POV, no matter how distorted + uninformed it may be. I have absolutely NO intention to try to sway your position either way since we both have had very constructive, albeit opposing, dialogue here in connection with our position re Wynn. I look forward to meeting you in person, unfortunately it didn't work out the last time you were here in Vegas. Just a bit of news that I would like to share (on my behalf of course), as reported in today's RJ, Wynn Resorts, Ltd. (including BOTH WLV + Encore) stands to lose $30M in tax breaks from [their] bottom line, while six of Wynn's direct + future major competitors have ALREADY been exempted!

Also, Brian, I would not classify Wynn's upcoming NLRB investigation/hearing on July 30th + the 75% vote to successfully organize a dealers union as a "small bump". I do not know the WLV guests that you have been in contact with, but I can confirm that the morale over there is DECLINING at an unprecedented rate which can literally "be cut with a butter knife", particularly with respect to casino floor personnel. The overall morale of employees, quite understandably @ WLV are currently at its lowest ebb since the joint opened for business. Wynn management continues to write-up phony complaints/violations on MANY of their casino floor employees, dealers, etc. after this entire union issue first became a reality. Boxmen have been fired left-and-right for frivolous violations + nut-job Steve will NOT back down from, what amounts to STEALING revenue + tokes which rightfully belong to the dealers + NOT management. I predict that a contract will NEVER be reached because Steve is a stupid stubborn idiot! Brian, I do not intend to cross the line here + invade your personal privacy, but considering that we have previously had "one-on-one" contact, is it true that you actually NAMED your kid after Steve Wynn? Please tell me it ain't so! I understand that you are most likely one of Steve's most devoted "followers" but that's simply crazy.

One final commnet, sorry Hunter for continuing this off-topic issue, but I insist it necessary to be allowed an appropriate forum in order to defend myself from the defamatory + malicious comments made by this troll JW: To our RESIDENT ENGLISH MAJOR here, "JW", does the "W" stand for "Wynn" or is this just an anonymous screen name? Well pal, despite the fact that you have insinuated I lack competency in the English language, let me inform you that I have personally prepared my own contracts worth well over $50M in business deals over a thirteen year period, and in addition, have also personally written both legal briefs + arguments on my behalf (even while being represented at the sametime by some of L.A.'s leading "hotshot" defense attorneys). With the exception of technical legal "language" my briefs + motions were submitted virtually unaltered + I prevalied on 95%+ in all matters. What say you JW?

June 2, 2007 5:59 PM Posted by Leonard Stern

Hunter, I promise that this will be my very LAST off-topic post in connection with this thread but I have really been RILED over this troll, JW's comments that you elected to publish which was directed towards me personally. JW, or whoever the f*ck you are, please feel free to challenge me on ANY of my hundreds of posts on this very blog that "lack factual evidence" + to the extent that I am able to reveal my "sources" without compromise, I am willimg to respond to any + all of your opposing, slanderous + potentially liable remarks. So, JW, be a man + step up to the plate + let's discuss your accusations on a public forum. If you chose to NOT respond, it only serves to prove the fact that you are nothing but a pussy troll with no other agenda but to try + discredit my well-deserved, respected reputation as an EXPERT in this very industry, which has long been confirmed by having revealed my true + actual idenity that dates back to my early childhood. Dude, give it up, you know absolutely NOTHING or you would otherwise be willing to debate me on each + every comment that I have made on this very forum which allegedly cites "mysterious facts" + "sources" which I can not guarantee to be truthful + otherwise substantiate. That's it, no more of this B.S. in connection with "JW". My suggestion to [you] is go get a REAL job or otherwise be prepared to defend all of your accusations that you have asserted towards me! Do you 'get it' JW, or perhaps my grammar is so substandard that you cannot read this. End of story! I eat people like you for breakfast!!!

June 2, 2007 8:35 PM Posted by mike_ch

So, how 'bout that Atlantic City?

June 2, 2007 9:06 PM Posted by Hunter

Actually, for the record, I didn't post that comment... I have a couple of other folks that approve comments when I'm not available, plus if you sign up for an account then comments are auto-approved.

Honestly, I wouldn't have approved the comment if I had seen it in the queue as it did nothing but throw us further off-topic and is at least border-line against the guidelines... So perhaps I owe you an apology as I don't think it should have been published... But once its out there, not much I could do and thus that's why I published your reply, since everyone should have a chance to defend themselves but yeah, this is the end of the line for this discussion. If you guys want to 'take this outside', I'm happy to try to connect you outside this venue but yeah, it's off topic.

For legitimate but otherwise off-topic discussion, we have a new thread - discuss legit off-topic Vegas stuff there - discuss personal stuff in an email conversation. Thx.

June 2, 2007 9:34 PM Posted by John

Sorry about being off-topic, but Leonard as much as you have been accurate over 99% of the time, there is one thing that you said that I doesn't seem to have ended up being correct. When CityCenter first received its glass facade, you stated that it was sub-standard and was only a test pattern. Well, it doesn't look like it really panned out that way, I mean they have put it on four floors already and it has been placed completely around the building on at least floors one and two. However, other than that one post, your comments have been pretty much spot on accurate.

[Ed: This entry has strayed too far and only appears to be going further. Closed. There is an open topic on the blog you can post on that was added today.]